Melisa Liberman—Mastering the Art of Value-Based Consulting

Nigel Rawlins: Melissa, welcome to the Wisepreneurs podcast. Could you introduce yourself and tell us where you're from?

Melisa Liberman: Thanks for having me, Nigel. I'm so happy to be here. I am from Colorado. I live south of Denver, so it's in the kind of mountainous region of the U. S. and I am a coach, a business coach, for independent consultants. And what that means is I help people who have left corporate, who are running their own consulting businesses.

Typically, they're the only consultant in the business. Occasionally, they'll have subcontractors or those kinds of things, but they are working with corporate clients to achieve certain goals that those corporate clients have. I'm sure we'll talk more about that in detail. But the way that I got into this, I was a consultant basically all of my life in some form or fashion.

I worked at Accenture as my first job out of college, and then I quickly went to a startup company. A SaaS software company where we built software that helps companies globally manage all of their external workforce. So everything from contractors, to freelancers, to consultants, to consultancies like Accenture and everything in between.

And at that company I was the executive in charge of building out our implementation team that deployed the software around the world. And, when my husband had an opportunity to go back to school, which happened to be in Hawaii. And so I resigned from my corporate role that was about 12 years into the company where we had built it to a midsize company.

And we moved to Hawaii and when I resigned the company at that time, it was really hard to work remotely. That was about 12 years ago. But they asked me to to stay on as a consultant. The thought never crossed my mind that I was at the time, I think I was 37 years old. I didn't think I was old enough to be a consultant or seasoned enough to be a consultant.

And so luckily the, I became what I like to call a, an accidental consultant and have really never looked back. I've had a lot of opportunities to go back to corporate but I really love running my own business, doing my own thing and teaching other consultants to, to be successful as business owners as well.

That's the gist of it.

Nigel Rawlins: My wife went to Hawaii recently and she said it was quite an amazing country.

Melisa Liberman: It's an amazing place to live for sure.

Nigel Rawlins: Let's talk about what a consultant is, because I think in terms of work out there I've seen words like independent professional, being used, freelancers. Can you tell us a little bit more? You're talking about people who've come out of a corporate job, so maybe you could explain the sort of jobs they've come out of what you mean by consultants and the sort of work that they do.

Melisa Liberman: Yeah, Nigel. So, to your point, there's so many different terms used out there. Everything from freelancer, to independent consultant, to solo consultant, to micro boutique consultancy, all different types of terminology. But at the end of the day, the type of individuals that I work with have been some form of a leader or a specialist in corporate, and they have left corporate. Sometimes being pushed out of corporate happens , where I resigned, but, there's so many of us who have been pushed out of corporate because of restructuring or, quite frankly, our age but know they still want to contribute to their profession and to their family and that kind of thing.

And so, regardless of how you became a consultant, whether it was accidentally like I did or or intentionally as some consultants do. The terminology that I'm using here, as I speak about independent consultants, are those individuals who work with corporate clients. So it's a business to business type of an arrangement.

They're working with corporate clients to deliver some type of a service. And there's a wide range of different types of services that consultants offer to their corporate clients. Everything from executive coaching, where they're working with the one on one with potentially a corporate client and their company is paying for that service.

To leadership type training and assessments. I have clients who work in the HR space doing retention programs. Diversity, equity, and inclusion type programs, I've got a lot of clients in Europe as well as the U. S., a few in Australia and Singapore.

In this case in payment technologies, and helping companies to implement those from a strategic perspective. So the types of consultancies typically consultants will work in the same domain that they worked in corporate, whether it's in HR or in finance or in innovation, or actuarial services, just a broad range of different types of services helping their corporate clients to achieve certain goals that they've set. And the method by which the consultants, the independent consultants are working with their clients, range from everything from project based work, so let's say a corporate client wants to replace one of their technology systems, the consultants may roll up their sleeves and do that type of work, all the way to more advise and get paid by the hour or by the day, all the way to more advisory type work where they're not really doing any type of deliverables.

Even they're giving advice to their end clients on more of a retainer based model. And then there's so many different variations on that in between.

Nigel Rawlins: Now that's interesting when you say that. So what we're talking about is people who've worked in corporate and they've developed an expertise, a certain skill level, which is quite valuable. And then, either they're out because they're no longer required for that role.

Let's go back to the fact that once they're working for themselves, because it's not as if you just launch out of corporate and start a consultancy, you're actually running a business. So let's talk about that a bit, shall we?

Melisa Liberman: Yeah, sure. Oftentimes this is an unintentional process. There are times where people are working in corporate and maybe start a side gig as they call it, and start building up a book of business that way. But for the most part, what I find our consultants have left corporate. They're ready to start a business.

And it often happens, Nigel, that someone they know from their network, whether it's their former employer, like in my case, or just someone that they had previously worked with, perhaps a colleague or a peer or even a former corporate clients, when they were working in corporate, usually what happens is, or oftentimes what happens is one of those individuals from their network finds out that the person is doing some consulting work and asks them if they might be available to help with that type of work.

So for example, for me, when I left corporate and my former employer said, can you stay on and in a consulting capacity. That was my first client. My second client came from a former peer corporate peer, who had already left the company, was working somewhere else and needed some help operationalizing a startup company that he had started.

So those are the types of scenarios where most of the time when you start a consulting company, it, it it happens organically, where you land a client or two from your network and you realize, Oh, this is something I really want to do. I love the autonomy. I love the flexibility, the variety, the challenge of it.

And so then you can go through the mechanical steps of setting up a business and doing the legal parts and the insurance and that kind of thing which is very simple to do. Because it's a business of one, an independent consultant or a solo consultant, most of the time you have no employees.

You might have an assistant helping you, a virtual assistant doing a little bit of work or a bookkeeper, or even sometimes a subcontractor who's doing some work for you. But for the most part, it's an incredibly simple business model to establish and to land that first client or two.

Nigel Rawlins: The benefit of your network to get you clients would be magic. But in some cases, if you don't have that network or you want to launch yourself into a consultancy business, maybe you've got some skills, but you don't have the network, what do they have to do?

Melisa Liberman: Yeah. So the first thing that I always like to press is, a lot of times we think we don't have a network when we really do. So that's the first thing that I want to just re emphasize here. I was working with a consultant and he told me he, he didn't have a network and the people he did know didn't need his services.

Which sounded, logical on the surface of it, but as we started digging into it, we realized he did have a network. For him he had lost his job and he was embarrassed by that. And he kept ruling people out that he did know. It turns out that his neighbor who he was avoiding seeing, he wasn't going to the mailbox at the same time.

So his neighbor wouldn't realize that he wasn't working. This was a few years ago, so it's probably not as common anymore that so many of us are working from home, but he was really avoiding that neighbor and it ends up turning out that neighbor connected him to his first client. First of all I want to just reemphasize, we think that we don't have a network and a lot of times we're discounting the network that we have, or we're ruling them out because we're afraid and, or fearful of rejection, those kinds of things.

So that's the first thing is to make sure that you truly don't have a network. So we, so many of us do. The second is even if you don't have a network of buyers, so people that might want to hire you as a consultant, you likely have a network of people who could connect you to the people who have those needs.

And so getting really clear about that. Those are the first two things I would say. The third thing that I would say, and this is in a chapter, I think nine in my book, which is I encourage people to create what I call a 5C list. That 5C list is when you think about what type of consulting you want to do.

Just get clear about we want to work with a certain type of client doing a certain type of work, creating a certain outcome. Once you understand that, then you can start thinking about and building out this 5C list. The 5Cs are what clients, what potential people do you know in your network who might have the services that you'd be offering? What are the customers? What are the companies that could be a really good ideal client for you, even if you don't know anyone there so that you can start strategizing. How do I get an introduction into this company? Maybe your neighbor knows them, or maybe they're at an event that you could be attending.

The third C is collaborators. So these are people that you know are really well networked that could introduce you to those ideal clients. The fourth are what are channel partners. So you may know people at software companies who work with your ideal client or other service companies that work with your ideal client, or even meeting other independent consultants.

It's a lonely, it's a lonely existence sometimes for us. Meeting other independent consultants who work with your ideal client, who potentially do a different type of consulting that would be a good, mutually beneficial arrangement. And then the fifth C are really thinking about what challenges those ideal clients might have.

They might be in the news, they had a reorganization or a merger and acquisition, like really thinking about what might be some of those challenges that ideal clients face that would open the door for you to start having conversations with them..

Nigel Rawlins: That's pretty amazing. You obviously thought an awful lot about consulting over the years. You've had to practice it as well. And I've also noticed that you've got, I've forgotten how many, 154 podcast episodes. So you've put a lot of thought into this. How have you managed to distill your ideas down to this?

Melisa Liberman: Yes. Great question, Nigel. So the first thing that I will say is it took me a while to figure out this is the focus that I wanted to have. As I described, I was an accidental consultant and I really loved the flexibility and to be able to create an income, my husband was in school at the time and we were living in Hawaii.

So it was really expensive. It was great to have that income. And so then I realized that I loved consulting so much. And as I was working with the clients, what ended up happening was helping startups scale. So I was working with the executives primarily in those small organizations, helping them figure out how to grow their revenue, how to operationalize the work that they were doing. But what I noticed is I would get pulled away so often by the executives. They were having conflicts with each other. They were trying to figure out how to convince the CEO to do something. I absolutely loved that one on one coaching and support that I gave those clients.

And so from there it evolved into going back and getting a coaching certification. And I tried out a lot of different things. I, at one point I was helping tech leaders find jobs. So I was doing a job search coaching and I sat back one day and so I just decided to test out a lot of things and see what I loved.

And I sat back one day and I thought to myself, why am I helping people find jobs in corporate? I'll never go back there again. This is, it just feels out of alignment. And so it was at that point that I realized that I had built so many different types of businesses that I felt finally qualified to help other consultants to build their businesses as well.

And so I think it was four or five years ago, I might've lost track of time, maybe even longer than that, where I really decided to specialize and focus only on helping consultants grow their businesses. And I'll tell you the way that I've distilled so many of the tools and the process that I share with consultants is that by releasing a podcast every single week, and I rarely do interviews it's a different type of podcast, right, that you do, then what I do, and there's definitely pros and cons to both approaches, for sure. For me, I love using this weekly format to distill what have I heard this week that they've been challenged with? What are the themes that I'm hearing? How could I turn that into an episode? Of course not using anyone's name or anything like that, but just thinking about frameworks and methodologies and strategies and tools that I can share with other independent consultants that might help them as well.

And from there over the course of time here doing this podcast, my podcast for so many years, and helping independent consultants grow their business, I just saw what worked over and over again and refined that. And the exercise of writing a book really has helped me to distill that even so much further and make the process that I've created so much more distinct.

Nigel Rawlins: So basically you've picked up the patterns and obviously through your own experience as well and connected them all. Now, the interesting thing about having guests that I've found is I'm seeing patterns and themes across the world for example, working in some locations actually stimulated further businesses through some experiences that some of the the guests have had. So, so yes, but to do 154 podcasts, that's a lot of sensing, a lot of pattern matching that you're seeing. So let's just go back a little bit. Now a consultant can go out and do work. And we spoke a little bit about setting up a formal business or a structure, but in running a business, one, they've got to get clients.

They've also got to manage themselves, haven't they? And collect the financials and bank some money and all that sort of thing. So can we talk about the things that they need to be doing? Like they can't just go out and do work. They also have to get work and do the work and do other things.

So can we talk a little bit about that?

Melisa Liberman: Absolutely. I like to call it you all of a sudden you've landed every single role in your company. You went from maybe the VP of some of operations and now all of a sudden you're the business owner, you're the CEO, you're the CFO. You're the chief sales officer. You're all the things.

And I also love to think about it in the sense that you're a, you being a consultant is a different role. The person who's selling the business, which is also you, but a different persona in this case, the person selling the business has to agree with the person delivering the business on what the schedule is going to look like and the rates and really wearing all of those different hats. And so sometimes as consultants, we think I'm not that great at sales and marketing. Many of us think that I certainly did. And I, and quite frankly, I was right. I was very bad at it. We're really good. So many of us think to ourselves, I'm really good at delivering for my clients, helping my clients achieve a certain results.

But the process of acquiring that client, I am that is not my strength. And so, but at the end of the day, now you're a business owner and now you are responsible for selling and marketing yourself. And and I've got to start really building up two things, the skill set to market and sell your services alongside the mindset that's required to confidently do so.

And one of the things just to jump ahead a little bit here, Nigel, one of the things that I find can be really valuable for consultants is we do get into that head space that we're selling ourselves and it just makes it really a lot harder. It makes, none of us really wants to sell ourself, and so I always like to remind consultants that you're really not selling yourself. You're not pitching yourself. You're not interviewing for anything. What you are doing is selling a result that you can help the client to achieve. And so Separating yourself out a little bit can make that process easier.

But back to your original question, the point here is you've got to really intentionally think about all those different hats you're wearing and figure out how to cover all the bases. For me, one of the first things that I recommend for consultants is get to the place where you can bring on a bookkeeper.

It's an easily transferable task. It's a very low value in the sense of comparing that to you delivering for clients and generating revenue. And so start to, starting to think about that kind of, and budgeting for that kind of support can make it a lot easier as well.

Nigel Rawlins: Yes. I think the whole point is that somebody going out to work for themselves, they're not working 40 hours a week. I mean, it'd be lovely if you could. But how many hours do you think in a year can a consultant work do you think?

Melisa Liberman: I have, it really depends on what you want to be doing. It could be anywhere from 10 hours a week to 80 hours a week. And that's the flexibility of this type of a business model is getting to the place where you know exactly what you want out of your business in terms of how much revenue you want to generate, how much time you want to be working.

What the balance of time working in your business with clients looks like compared to working on your business and doing the types of things that are required as a business owner and really being clear with yourself about what it is you want and then building your business model around that.

Nigel Rawlins: Geez, I was thinking if you're doing an 80 hour week, it's not going to be much time for anything else.

Melisa Liberman: No, definitely not. I don't know anyone else who wants to build an 80 hour a week business. But it can happen if you don't build out something intentionally. I had one client, a consultant who came to me and she was, she told me she had not taken vacation, she had gone places, but she was still working for 15 years because she was so nervous about choosing between billing for the hour, $200 or whatever she was billing at versus taking that hour off. And so she was definitely burned out. And so part of that process for her was figuring, shifting her business model, so she wasn't charging based on time anymore and putting herself in that situation where she had to choose between one or the other.

Nigel Rawlins: Now that's an interesting point you just made there about not taking holidays because that's something I'm hearing. That a lot of self employed or whatever we call them independent professionals are not taking the breaks. They're not looking after themselves and embarrassed to take holidays because they're worried that they're going to lose work.

Now I've got to admit my wife and I have booked a three week cruise next year, and I didn't realize there was an extra week on the end in Japan. Four weeks away, and I'm thinking, how am I going to do that?

Melisa Liberman: That's amazing,

Nigel Rawlins: I don't know how I'm going to do it, but, oh the first thing I've got to make sure is that I'm going to get access to internet whilst I'm away and manage the business because I look after 18 clients.

guess that's the reluctance for a lot of consultants to take a break because one, they might miss opportunities and all that, but I think he just hit it on the nail is that if you can get out of the hourly, charging, and you either work, well, I work on retainers so that I'm constantly available depends on the need.

So let's just talk about that getting away from the hourly, because is that the the blocker that stops them taking their breaks or looking after themselves?

Melisa Liberman: It's definitely one of them, Nigel. One of the blockers, I think, and I'll speak to that here in a moment, but I think the other, some of the other blockers are really thinking about, For you, for example, when you go on vacation for one month, what could your business look like in order to support that? Does it look like bringing in other resources that can do some support for your clients while you're gone, handle the low hanging fruit?

Does it look like front loading some of your revenue? There's so many different ways to accomplish this when we think about our business in an intentional way and think about how can I solve this type of a challenge, in a way that benefits both me by taking time off and rejuvenating and also my clients by continuing to get the support that that they need, but also benefiting from you being rejuvenated when you come back and having space and time to even think, right?

So I always like to encourage consultants to think about and build their business model around, around the types of offers that they, the consulting offers that they have for their clients and the schedule that they create so that they are able to have that flexibility. And and then it's not something that is a rare occurrence, but it's just part of the way they do business.

But back to your question about how do you start shifting into non time based arrangements it comes from, number one, being really clear about what it is that you're selling. A lot of us think we're selling our time, or we think we're selling access to ourselves, or we're just used to the way that we think about things in corporate. And maybe you've even hired consultants when you were in corporate and paid them by the hour. At the end of the day, you're not selling your time. You're selling an outcome that the client is wanting to achieve. And so you've got to really be thinking about the way you design your offers to your ideal clients, like what those packages look like, or those service offerings look like, and what outcomes the client would achieve by engaging you and then also think about from a calculating the value of the work that you're doing, of the outcomes that you're doing. I walk consultants through an exercise on really thinking about quantifying on a line by line level, what is the value of the outcome? It might be more revenue that you're helping a client achieve.

It might be cost savings you're helping a client achieve. It might be employee retention and replacement costs you're helping them to avoid. Really thinking about all those end results that a client is wanting to accomplish and quantifying those so that ultimately you fold that back into your pricing.

Nigel Rawlins: So you're talking about the consultant understanding the value that they're creating for their client. And that's a big step too. I guess if you've been working as a consultant, you've just, you've been delivering something, but then thinking in terms of that value unless you can do some of the financials, it's going to be a little bit of a tricky sort of calculation, but what I can hear from what you're saying is that your advice to them is because you know what they're going through, you've seen the patterns, you're able to carry them through. So I'm assuming that these people who are working with you are able to bring in reasonably sized fees because they've got to be able to afford you as well. But I can see the benefit too. I mean you'll keep them grounded. So how does it work working with you? yeah,

Melisa Liberman: Yeah, I work with consultants to your point, they they are making money or know that they have the skill set to make money, have been previously making money in corporate, and I help them to, if they're newer to consulting, to replace their corporate income by landing clients and setting up their business in a way that will be sustainable from the outset.

So many, like the client I was mentioning didn't take a vacation for 15 years. We had to do a lot of rework. There are a lot of clients, consultants who want to start from the beginning and set a really strong foundation of what they're offering to those ideal clients and being able quantify the result and in an estimated way, of course, and then ultimately create pricing that is aligned to that, and to be able to work on their own terms to be able to work according to the schedule they want to take. I have one client, a consultant who centered her entire business model around being able to take three or four months off in the summer because she sails competitively. So figuring out what those business offerings look like and marrying that up with what the clients want, as well as the schedule that you're wanting to accomplish as a business owner as well that's the type of work that I do with clients.

The other type of work that I do with clients are existing consultants who have had some success in their business and they're ready to grow or maybe they're having an issue with not taking time off or they know they're underpricing themselves or they don't have a pipeline that's as robust as they need it to be in order to hit their financial goals and feel less stressed. Those are the types of things that I do with consultants helping them to be as successful as business owners as they are as delivering.

Nigel Rawlins: Isn't it interesting when you've got a job, you don't have to think about any of that. But here you're saying, okay, I've got to think about the value that I create. So I've got to do that. So I've got to really understand what I do and how that benefits the client. Then I've got to figure out how am I going to attract the clients I want? And how do I keep them coming so that I don't end up with a couple of months without work and get all desperate? I've got to run a business as well, so I've got to make sure the money's coming in, and it's banked, and that I don't spend it all. I guess that's the other thing too, is if you're a consultant and you're earning a lot of money, You can't get to keep all the money, can you?

What have you got to do with that money?

Melisa Liberman: Yeah, you definitely want to save money for taxes, especially the way our taxes work in the U. S. You've got to save that money. I had a client in Canada who hadn't saved as much money as she should have and ended up having to go back to corporate for a while because of that kind of mistake.

So definitely want to be saving money for taxes. I always love to recommend that consultants create a reserve fund in their business as well. Two or three months worth of operating expenses, including their own salary. So that to your point, Nigel, you don't get to a place where maybe you're in between projects and then you feel desperate and take on work that's less meaningful, less fulfilling, lower paying, that kind of thing. So, being able to really have a financial plan, you're the CFO of your business, having that kind of financial plan is really important.

Nigel Rawlins: Is it a particular type of person who can do this? Because I would think a lot of people think, oh, that's just too hard.

Melisa Liberman: I think a lot of us, we don't give ourselves credit for the knowledge that we've developed and accumulated in corporate. If you're a project manager, for example, you're really good at, you're really good at managing projects step by step and helping to achieve a certain milestone or ultimate objective.

That is a marketable skill set as a consultant. You might have had really specific expertise and experience in corporate, in a certain industry, or doing a certain function in your company, like HR or finance or some kind of a technology type of a skill set. There are so many people out there that I find that think they don't have what it takes to be a consultant.

I was one of them as I described to you I thought I wasn't old enough or didn't have enough experience But we discount what we do know And we discount the value of things that come naturally to us that we think just everyone can do because it comes so easily to us when in fact those types of skill sets and experiences and knowledge are incredibly valuable to companies.

And so what I find is a lot of times it's really interesting to me because I do work with higher end consultants. Some of them PhDs, some of them went to the top schools in the world, and you would be shocked to know how much insecurity they have and what we call imposter syndrome where they think they don't know enough and someone's going to find out they're a fraud.

And as human beings, I think so many of us experience that so, I would just encourage whomever is listening to, to really think about what it is that you do know, what experience have you accumulated and what kinds of companies might benefit from that and start thinking about approaching business and starting a business in that way.

Nigel Rawlins: Can you tell us something about the book you wrote? Because, obviously, if you've been doing this for a number of years, you've done that many podcasts, you've got a lot of material to share. One of your podcasts, you went through your 14 systems overview over three podcasts, I noticed. So is that what the book was about?

Melisa Liberman: Yeah. So the book is called Grow Your Consulting business, The 14 Step Roadmap to Make Your Consulting Goals a Reality, your independent consulting goals a reality. And so what it is it's really this what I've done is just distill down what I know. What are the 14 systems that I see over and over again, that the consultants who are the most successful have in place in their businesses so that it creates a benchmark for other consultants who want to grow a business or want to achieve a different level of success in their business.

They have that, we'll call it a gold standard to compare their own business too, and use it to identify priorities, identify gaps that they might have so they can start filling those in. And use it to optimize what they already do have in place so that it's working more effectively and getting them the results that they're looking for.

Nigel Rawlins: So it's almost a manual to keep in mind, these are the things that the good operators do. Now, one of the problems I have, cause I'm on Twitter and LinkedIn and Facebook. There are a lot of gurus out there saying buy my course 150 bucks or $999. And, when you're older like me and like yourself, you think, how do these people, I mean, have they really got the depth of knowledge?

Have they done the hard years or are they just flogging something ? Because when I look at your stuff, to have produced 154 podcasts, consulting, you've done the work yourself. You work with a lot of consultants and you've got the 14 points. It's it's, it looks much easier to take on these other quick fixes compared to this. What are your thoughts about who's helping and who's able to help out there?

Melisa Liberman: Yeah, I think that's so true. I purchased a lot of those, Nigel, when I was in the beginning of, you too, when I was in the beginning of my business, because we're just grasped. I don't know, at least for me, you tell me how your experience was, but I was just grasping for where to start. I didn't know what I, what kind of business I wanted to build.

I shared with you some of the false starts that I had. I was just really trying to understand, and it's a learning curve, it's a steep learning curve from going from being a corporate employee and having so much infrastructure in place and having more of a role in the process to being responsible for everything and it can be really easy to fall into the place of whoever's the loudest or the most prevalent thinking they know more than you do about what you should be doing and going down all of those rabbit trails. I did so many of them and I don't regret it. They were all learning opportunities, but looking back now, I think, wow, that there are so many things, courses I invested in that had no relevance.

Or were just very early. I was so early stage, they should have been for someone who is five years into business or whatever. So I guess I would say it can be easy to fall into that trap when you're looking for a solution and starting to trying to get your footing. And just to really take a step back into your point, ask the person that I'm thinking about buying this course from do they have any expertise in what I want to be doing?

Or is this more broadly focused. That's why I love giving out so many free resources. I've received emails and messages from so many people who tell me so many successes they've had. And I'll never work with them directly. But just to be able to give that value to people and some small percentage of them work with me to me is important because I am so passionate about helping people work on their own terms and not have to go back to corporate roles unless they really want to.

Nigel Rawlins: I think that's where the future of work is going, that we will be independent professionals, or those of us with professional qualifications will be able to fit into that, because I think that sort of lifestyle is a more interesting one. Who really does want to be stuck in a job 50 hours a week? I mean, some of us, maybe, or some people, may not have any choice in the matter.

I've spent a lot of money on courses and I still do. And I've done some recently, I thought that was pretty ordinary. Or somebody a quarter of the price did a better program. And that's the danger just because it's got a high price doesn't mean it's a good one. But my thoughts are if I'm in a corporate job and I'm starting to think this is not good, I would be looking at your book.

And taking the time because I think that's the secret of all this. Nothing happens overnight. We know that. It can take 10 years to really get your business going. I mean, I've been going 25 years now and I'm now getting on top of it and still doing courses. Like I've got half a dozen I haven't even started that I've paid for that I want to get going, but geez, I can't find where the time is.

Melisa Liberman: I didn't mention this when we were back in that section, but I have a checklist that people can download if they want to start a consulting business to help them know where to even start.

Nigel Rawlins: I have quite long show notes, so I'll put all that detail in. Well, Melissa what are some of the things that they can go to your website and start having a look at what you do?

Melisa Liberman: Yeah. So first of all, if you're brand new or haven't even yet started as a consultant, if you go to my website, there's something called the IEC Toolkit, Independent Consultants Toolkit. And there are resources there, including the 12 steps to start your consulting business. So that gives just a very clear, concise checklist.

It happens to be 26 page ebook. It's a free ebook. So I give you, I won't say concise, it gives you a lot of detail around exactly what to do to get started as a consultant and kind of around some of the things you're talking about, Nigel, if you haven't yet started as a consultant, what might the domain or industry or type of consulting be that you target?

And helping you to really figure out some of those big questions that can be tricky to answer for us when we're first getting started. So there's that ebook that could be really valuable, those 12 steps. And then if you're in this stage of your consulting business where you've already started as a consultant and you, maybe you got a taste of it, like I did as an accidental independent consultant, and you know that you want to grow this into a self sustaining business and reach the business goals that you have, taking time off and generating the revenue you want to be generating and doing the type of work you want to be doing. There are several assessments on my website that can help you, so you can go in and put in and answer questions about what you're doing right now and it will give you a personalized report on some gaps that I notice in your business that you would want to prioritize in order to reach your goals. So there's a pricing assessments, there's a, as a growth assessment. So giving you a lot of diagnostic tools when you're in that stage of your business, that you're ready to really make this a legitimate long term business for yourself.

And then the last component of the IEC toolkit is scaling. So when you get to that place where you may want to move into being more of a boutique agency or a micro boutique, or even just having a couple of contractors who work alongside you. So you're not the only person delivering for clients. There, there are resources on the, on that toolkit for you as well.

So you can find that. I'm sure we'll put the link in the show notes, but it's called IEC for independent consultants toolkit.

The other thing is Nigel, you mentioned the book a couple of times. I have a free download of the book on my website. So you can go download the book. It's at my website and melissalieberman.

com forward slash book. And you can download the entire PDF and all of those 14 steps to create a growing, thriving consulting

Nigel Rawlins: That's amazing. You have put so much work into this. Now, one last question I've got before we'll start closing up. Does age make any difference when you start this?

Melisa Liberman: I don't believe age makes any difference. In fact we could go down this path probably, but I do believe, and I've seen it firsthand that age, it can be challenging to find new roles that are equivalent to the experience that you have from a full-time corporate perspective, as you get older, there is ageism and it can be hard to find a job. As a consultant though, age is oftentimes a benefits.

And while that ageism is fairly commonplace in corporate America for full time employees. What I find is that the opposite can be true for consultants where having more experience, having more expertise, having a longer term career and a variety of experiences can actually be seen as a benefit or even a differentiator as a consultant.

So oftentimes, when you might be a quote unquote aged out of a corporate world and not able to continue progressing, shifting into consulting can open up so many other doors that you may not have considered previously. So that's what I see from a consultant's perspective as it relates to age.

And like we were talking about earlier, just spreading the word and the idea of building a consulting business that can be, we've talked a lot about some advanced strategies today, but it can be a really simple business model to generate income and to feel more fulfilled and to create some balance between having flexibility and personal time with continuing to contribute in some form of a professional way. So it's an incredible business model, whether you want something that's part time and generating some extra income all the way to growing a robust business that eventually you could sell to another company even

Nigel Rawlins: Thank you, Melissa, for joining the Wisepreneurs podcast. It was wonderful to have you as a guest.

Melisa Liberman: I just want to say thank you so much, Nigel, for having me here today. I'm excited to be able to speak with your community and to give insight into what it might look like to be an independent consultant working for corporate clients, helping them to benefit from the expertise and industry knowledge and variety of different experiences you've had over the course of your professional careers and potentially open up other opportunities for you to create income for your listeners to create income in a different way.